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Sound Leadership: Harnessing the Power of Podcasts in Leadership Development

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Title: Sound Leadership: Harnessing the Power of Podcasts in Leadership Development
Language: English
Authors: Brittany Devies (ORCID 0000-0003-3025-5613), Lauren Bullock (ORCID 0000-0002-4813-1689), Daniel M. Jenkins (ORCID 0000-0002-5895-2587), Scott J. Allen (ORCID 0000-0002-9371-2036), Joanna Stanberry (ORCID 0000-0002-1184-2874)
Source: New Directions for Student Leadership. 2025 (185):45-52.
Availability: Wiley. Available from: John Wiley & Sons, Inc. 111 River Street, Hoboken, NJ 07030. Tel: 800-835-6770; e-mail: cs-journals@wiley.com; Web site: https://www.wiley.com/en-us
Peer Reviewed: Y
Page Count: 8
Publication Date: 2025
Document Type: Journal Articles
Reports - Evaluative
Descriptors: Leadership Training, Popular Culture, Audio Equipment, Telecommunications, Programming (Broadcast), Mass Media, Teaching Methods, Educational Strategies, Technology Uses in Education, Technology Integration
DOI: 10.1002/yd.20653
ISSN: 2373-3349
2373-3357
Abstract: This article explores the pedagogical considerations of using pop-culture podcasts as an instructional strategy in leadership development. We clarify key concepts, evaluate podcasts as an instructional tool, and provide recommendations and implications for their integration into leadership learning experiences. While an important consideration for educators, more research is needed about the efficacy of this instructional strategy. Nonetheless, podcasts are an important consideration for program architects seeking contemporary connections to leadership learning.
Abstractor: As Provided
Entry Date: 2025
Accession Number: EJ1462373
Database: ERIC
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  Value: <anid>AN0183689326;[i75m]01mar.25;2025Mar18.06:13;v2.2.500</anid> <title id="AN0183689326-1">Sound Leadership: Harnessing the Power of Podcasts in Leadership Development </title> <sbt id="AN0183689326-2">Introduction</sbt> <p>This article explores the pedagogical considerations of using pop‐culture podcasts as an instructional strategy in leadership development. We clarify key concepts, evaluate podcasts as an instructional tool, and provide recommendations and implications for their integration into leadership learning experiences. While an important consideration for educators, more research is needed about the efficacy of this instructional strategy. Nonetheless, podcasts are an important consideration for program architects seeking contemporary connections to leadership learning.</p> <p>Across the internet, there are 4,318,424 registered podcasts. Interestingly, this number is down from 4,449,114 in December 2021. Among the registered podcasts, Apple reports 89,947,847 published episodes as of January 2024 (Gray [<reflink idref="bib16" id="ref1">16</reflink>]). According to Edison Research ([<reflink idref="bib13" id="ref2">13</reflink>]), the most popular genres for Q1 of 2024 were comedy, society/culture, news, true crime, and sports. Undoubtedly, it is a popular medium for consuming content, and naturally, some portion of these episodes are impactful supplements to a leadership curriculum, course, or workshop. Their benefits include the ability for learners to listen on‐demand from virtually anywhere in the world, and educators can feature thought leaders, provocative topics/perspectives, and unique learning experiences beyond the typical lecture or slide deck.</p> <p>In transparency, the authors of this article identify as podcasters. We have each served as hosts, guests, and in some cases, producers. Between us, we have released more than 430 episodes, and if you ever engage us in dialogue, you will quickly learn that we can talk for hours about the benefits, challenges, and insights about the medium. This article highlights the pedagogical benefits and considerations of podcasts as an instructional strategy in leadership learning. In doing so, we define key concepts, examine podcasts as a pedagogical tool, and offer recommendations and implications for integration into teaching and training.</p> <hd id="AN0183689326-3">Podcasts, Defined</hd> <p>Kidd ([<reflink idref="bib23" id="ref3">23</reflink>]) described a podcast as a distributed audio file that listeners can subscribe to through a designated platform. Unlike radio, where listeners tune in at scheduled times, podcasts provide the flexibility to listen on‐demand. Salmon and Nie ([<reflink idref="bib37" id="ref4">37</reflink>]) described podcasts in education as a, "...true 'high‐value, low‐cost' approach," (<reflink idref="bib3" id="ref5">3</reflink>) to learning in universities. Allen ([<reflink idref="bib1" id="ref6">1</reflink>].) went so far as to suggest, "Podcasts are invaluable tools when designing a multi‐modal curriculum" (para. 2). While this may be a stretch, they <emph>are</emph> a consideration for instructional designers, educators, and program architects.</p> <p>Podcasts, as digital audio or video files accessible via the internet, offer a versatile platform for educational content delivery. Allen ([<reflink idref="bib2" id="ref7">2</reflink>]) highlighted their value in designing multi‐modal curriculums, emphasizing their role in enhancing learning through diverse modalities. Positioned within the educational spectrum, podcasts can serve as either instructor‐generated content to augment classroom learning or student‐produced material to demonstrate mastery, embodying a flexible yet impactful educational tool.</p> <p>Podcasts come in various formats and focus on multiple areas of content (Sharon [<reflink idref="bib38" id="ref8">38</reflink>]). Before integrating podcasts into teaching, it is crucial for educators to understand how podcasts are organized. This understanding is essential because the format and type of podcast set the audience's expectations, which are central to any communication method. For example, news podcasts, such as <emph>The Daily</emph> by <emph>The New York Times</emph>, deliver concise, topic‐focused updates that are ideal for introducing current events or leadership challenges rooted in global issues. Opinion podcasts, such as <emph>Freakonomics Radio</emph>, offer in‐depth commentary and thought‐provoking discussions from experts and guests, which can stimulate critical thinking in leadership ethics or decision‐making courses.</p> <p>Narrative podcasts like <emph>How I Built This</emph> by <emph>Guy Raz</emph> often use storytelling to explore entrepreneurial journeys, making them particularly relevant for courses on innovation and leadership. Interview‐style podcasts, such as <emph>Phronesis: Practical Wisdom for Leaders</emph>, provide perspectives from leadership scholars and practitioners, aligning well with discussions on leadership theories and applications. These examples illustrate the evolving depth and variety of podcasts, underscoring the importance of educators being well‐versed in podcast formats to effectively meet audience expectations and enhance the learning experience.</p> <p>Podcasts are an accessible avenue for elevating perspectives and voices often excluded from historically heavily relied upon course materials, like books and journal articles. As an audio medium, podcasts can be great ways to go directly to an expert source on any topic. This can be particularly helpful for bringing in marginalized voices and experiences that may not be centered in books and journals. It can also be helpful to bring in current and contemporary events that may not have been written about; for example, if a new policy was passed in the United States government, you could likely find a political podcast published the next morning offering commentary where publishing an analysis of the topic could take months or years. The timely publication and vast variety of podcast offerings can help educators infuse pop culture into leadership education.</p> <hd id="AN0183689326-4">Leadership</hd> <p>Leadership is a socially constructed phenomenon that is informed by and enacted depending on one's own lived experiences (Billsberry [<reflink idref="bib7" id="ref9">7</reflink>]; Devies [<reflink idref="bib9" id="ref10">9</reflink>]; Dugan [<reflink idref="bib12" id="ref11">12</reflink>]; Guthrie et al. [<reflink idref="bib19" id="ref12">19</reflink>]; Guthrie et al. [<reflink idref="bib18" id="ref13">18</reflink>]; Volpe White et al. [<reflink idref="bib42" id="ref14">42</reflink>]). It can be conceptualized as, "...an influence relationship among leaders and followers who intend real changes that reflect their mutual purposes" (Rost [<reflink idref="bib34" id="ref15">34</reflink>], 102). Leadership development, "...refers to the human and intrapersonal aspects of leadership learning" (Guthrie and Jenkins [<reflink idref="bib20" id="ref16">20</reflink>], 61). It includes an individual leader's needs, values, motivation, identity, and other elements of self (Guthrie and Jenkins [<reflink idref="bib20" id="ref17">20</reflink>]). An emerging number of podcasts focus on the leadership process and leadership development. Using podcasts in leadership development helps educators infuse pop culture into their practice.</p> <hd id="AN0183689326-5">Pedagogy</hd> <p>In the dynamic realm of higher education, podcasts are increasingly recognized as a vital pedagogical tool, merging the richness of digital media with traditional educational values. This literature review delves into the multifaceted applications of podcasts in higher education and leadership development, examining their role in creating inclusive and engaging learning environments. From the foundational concept of "podagogy" introduced by Kidd ([<reflink idref="bib23" id="ref18">23</reflink>]) to the innovative practices highlighted by McCarron and Yamanaka ([<reflink idref="bib25" id="ref19">25</reflink>]), this discussion encapsulates the evolution of podcasts from mere digital files to powerful educational instruments. By integrating podcasts, educators and facilitators can offer diverse perspectives, support marginalized voices, and enhance students' leadership learning. This section aims to showcase the breadth of scholarship supporting the use of podcasts in education.</p> <hd id="AN0183689326-6">Podcasts as Pedagogy in Higher Education</hd> <p>In the evolving landscape of higher education, podcasts have emerged as a significant pedagogical tool, heralded for their adaptability and resonance with contemporary learning styles. Kidd ([<reflink idref="bib23" id="ref20">23</reflink>]) initiates the discussion by introducing "podagogy," a concept that underscores podcasts' role in fostering digital learning cultures. This notion is further expanded by Palenque ([<reflink idref="bib30" id="ref21">30</reflink>]), who connected podcasting to foundational educational philosophies, emphasizing its capacity to enrich active and social learning environments. Various teaching and learning centers include blogs on podcasting in higher education to ensure that instructors have immediate access to research on the effective use of podcasts in college classrooms (Rogers [<reflink idref="bib33" id="ref22">33</reflink>]).</p> <p>The practical application of podcasts in enhancing educational development is illustrated by Mooney ([<reflink idref="bib27" id="ref23">27</reflink>]), who shared insights from launching a campus‐based podcast series to foster interdisciplinary dialogue and connect students with faculty perspectives beyond the classroom. This initiative highlighted the potential of podcasts to humanize faculty members, create accessible entry points for complex topics, and encourage active engagement in learning outside traditional settings. For example, Mooney ([<reflink idref="bib27" id="ref24">27</reflink>]) observed that student listeners reported feeling more connected to their instructors and their disciplines, leading to increased class participation and curiosity about course content. Furthermore, the series demonstrated how podcasts could bridge gaps between theory and practice by featuring guest speakers who discussed real‐world applications of classroom concepts.</p> <p>Complementing this, Robson and Greensmith ([<reflink idref="bib32" id="ref25">32</reflink>]) conducted a study exploring the value of podcasts for revision purposes in higher education. Their research demonstrated how students appreciated the on‐demand and mobile nature of podcasts, which allowed them to revisit complex material at their own pace. Despite this benefit, the study revealed that students often viewed podcasts as a supplement rather than a replacement for traditional teaching methods, emphasizing the importance of blending multimedia tools with face‐to‐face instruction to maximize learning outcomes. Similarly, Hill et al. ([<reflink idref="bib21" id="ref26">21</reflink>]) found while podcasts provided flexible access to course material and enhanced understanding of key concepts, student feedback indicated a preference for interactive teaching approaches. This finding underscores the need for educators to thoughtfully integrate podcasts into broader teaching strategies rather than relying on them as standalone tools.</p> <hd id="AN0183689326-7">Podcasts as Pedagogy in Leadership Education, Training, and Development</hd> <p>In leadership education specifically, McCarron and Yamanaka ([<reflink idref="bib25" id="ref27">25</reflink>]) explored how podcasts can supplement course content effectively, especially in response to the challenges posed by the COVID‐19 pandemic. Dryburgh ([<reflink idref="bib11" id="ref28">11</reflink>]) discussed adapting teaching methods to Generation Z's technological fluency, using podcasts to convey leadership concepts. Similarly, Norsworthy and Herndon ([<reflink idref="bib28" id="ref29">28</reflink>]) advocated for student‐produced podcasts to engage with leadership and ethics, offering an experiential learning platform that cultivates critical thinking skills.</p> <p>Through a synthesis of the contributions from Kidd ([<reflink idref="bib23" id="ref30">23</reflink>]), Palenque ([<reflink idref="bib30" id="ref31">30</reflink>]), Mooney ([<reflink idref="bib27" id="ref32">27</reflink>]), Robson and Greensmith ([<reflink idref="bib32" id="ref33">32</reflink>]), Hill et al. ([<reflink idref="bib21" id="ref34">21</reflink>]), McCarron and Yamanaka ([<reflink idref="bib25" id="ref35">25</reflink>]), Dryburgh ([<reflink idref="bib11" id="ref36">11</reflink>]), and Norsworthy and Herndon ([<reflink idref="bib28" id="ref37">28</reflink>]), it is evident that podcasts are carving a niche in educational methodologies, promising enhanced engagement and personalized learning experiences in leadership education and beyond. Accordingly, Table 1 includes examples of instructional and assessment strategies that integrate podcasts at various levels. We organized the table by the instructional or assessment strategy, specific examples, and the components of Guthrie and Jenkins's ([<reflink idref="bib20" id="ref38">20</reflink>]) leadership learning framework.</p> <p>1 TABLE Integrating podcasts in leadership education: Instructional and assessment strategies aligned with the leadership learning framework.</p> <p> <ephtml> <table><thead><tr><th>Instructional/assessment strategy</th><th>Examples from our experience and/or the literature</th><th>Components of the leadership learning framework</th></tr></thead><tbody><tr><td>Case studies</td><td>Assign episodes that discuss real‐world business or leadership challenges. After listening, students can analyze and present solutions or alternative strategies (Jäger et al. <xref ref-type="bibr" rid="bibr22">2023</xref>)</td><td>Leadership knowledgeMetacognition</td></tr><tr><td>Read and respond</td><td>Use podcasts as an alternative to TED talks or other media (McCarron and Yamanaka <xref ref-type="bibr" rid="bibr25">2022</xref>). Assign podcasts as course materials to redefine scholarship, provide diverse voices, and accommodate different learning styles (Kidd <xref ref-type="bibr" rid="bibr23">2012</xref>). Students critique podcasts in relation to leadership theory, answer discussion questions, and compare multiple episodes on the same topic (e.g., 3–4 episodes on transformational leadership from various topics).</td><td>Leadership knowledgeLeadership observation</td></tr><tr><td>Interview a leader</td><td>Invite a mentor to join you for a podcast‐style interview (Owen et al. <xref ref-type="bibr" rid="bibr29">2007</xref>).</td><td>Leadership observationLeadership engagement</td></tr><tr><td>Art</td><td>Creating a podcast; listening to and critiquing a podcast (Guthrie and Jenkins <xref ref-type="bibr" rid="bibr20">2018</xref>)</td><td>Leadership developmentMetacognition</td></tr><tr><td>Discussion</td><td>Listening to a podcast episode and responding to discussion questions; students moderate a discussion forum based on a podcast episode assigned (Koppelman <xref ref-type="bibr" rid="bibr24">2013</xref>).</td><td>Leadership observationLeadership engagementMetacognition</td></tr><tr><td>Reflective journaling</td><td>Students listen to specific episodes, reflect on their implications, and connect content to course theories and personal experiences. Students journal on thoughts and applications from the episodes and try out new ideas (Mooney <xref ref-type="bibr" rid="bibr27">2019</xref>).</td><td>Leadership developmentLeadership observationLeadership engagementMetacognition</td></tr><tr><td>Storytelling</td><td>Students produce their own stories (e.g., personal leadership philosophy); long‐form storytelling; students listen to podcast interviews of leadership thought leaders (Besser et al. <xref ref-type="bibr" rid="bibr6">2022</xref>; Stanberry et al. <xref ref-type="bibr" rid="bibr39">2023</xref>; Teckchandani and Obstfeld <xref ref-type="bibr" rid="bibr41">2017</xref>)</td><td>Leadership developmentLeadership engagement</td></tr><tr><td>Media</td><td>Using podcasts in place of TED talks or YouTube videos from professional speakers or leadership experts</td><td>Leadership knowledge</td></tr><tr><td>Writing/speaking</td><td>Practice transforming a research paper into a podcast script (Bell <xref ref-type="bibr" rid="bibr5">2019</xref>). Students learn to apply information in different ways. Students work in groups to write podcast scripts and record episodes on leadership themes, creating a class podcast (Waldron et al. <xref ref-type="bibr" rid="bibr43">2023</xref>).</td><td>Leadership TrainingLeadership ObservationLeadership Engagement</td></tr><tr><td>Group projects</td><td>Students work in groups to write and record leadership‐themed podcast episodes, creating a class podcast (Besser et al. <xref ref-type="bibr" rid="bibr6">2022</xref>).</td><td>Leadership trainingLeadership engagement</td></tr><tr><td>Peer feedback</td><td>Students create podcast episodes and exchange them with classmates for feedback, promoting collaborative learning and constructive criticism (Sackstein <xref ref-type="bibr" rid="bibr36">2017</xref>).</td><td>Leadership observationLeadership developmentLeadership trainingMetacognitionLeadership engagement</td></tr><tr><td>Guest speaker</td><td>Record live guest speaker sessions with Q&A for a podcast episode, reducing the guest lecturer's load while scaffolding the lecture (Ferdiansyah et al. <xref ref-type="bibr" rid="bibr14">2023</xref>).</td><td>Leadership observationMetacognitionLeadership knowledge</td></tr><tr><td>Skill demonstration</td><td>Use podcasts on leadership skills (e.g., conflict resolution, team building) followed by role‐playing exercises or simulations (Ruben <xref ref-type="bibr" rid="bibr35">2006</xref>). Share with articles to focus on one skill (e.g., storytelling with general managers).</td><td>Leadership trainingLeadership developmentLeadership engagement</td></tr></tbody></table> </ephtml> </p> <hd id="AN0183689326-8">Creating Podcast Pedagogy</hd> <p>This section explores foundational, intermediate, and advanced instructional strategies for integrating podcasts into leadership education, balancing skills‐based learning with using podcasts as an alternative to traditional media. It also considers practical aspects such as time commitment and necessary resources, including podcasting equipment and potential campus partnerships with communication departments or radio stations.</p> <hd id="AN0183689326-9">Foundational Practice/Instructional Strategies</hd> <p>In Jenkins's graduate leadership foundations seminar, students embark on a semester‐long project titled "The Leadership Story," which prompts them to reflect on their leadership journeys using Meister et al.'s ([<reflink idref="bib26" id="ref39">26</reflink>]) framework. Students are instructed to read assigned <emph>Harvard Business Review</emph> (<emph>HBR</emph>) and <emph>Human Relations</emph> articles as well as an accompanying episode from <emph>HBR</emph>'s <emph>Women at Work</emph> podcast series titled "Seeing Ourselves as Leaders" and consider four lenses through which they might view their early leadership experiences: Being, Engaging, Performing, and Accepting. They must analyze their leadership development, natural tendencies toward these lenses, and the influence of social identities. This example is straightforward and uses a podcast episode to supplement the required reading. A more comprehensive assignment might ask students to analyze a set of leadership‐themed podcasts through the lens of evidence‐based practice in leadership studies or theory to see how well the series measures up to the research versus the host(s) sharing their lived experiences.</p> <p>Workshop facilitators can assign podcasts related to the workshop topic as prework. In those instances, facilitators can choose material that relates to either the skill development or the instrument being used in training. For example, Gallup provides hundreds of podcasts to support the CliftonStrengths instrument. Participants can listen to either 10‐ or 30‐min episodes on topics such as the general principles of the instrument, the explanation, and application of talent themes, and the shadow side.</p> <hd id="AN0183689326-10">Intermediate Practice/Instructional Strategy</hd> <p>Bullock's intermediate instructional strategy for using podcasts in leadership education involves assigning multiple podcasts across various class sessions in a graduate course. Students listen to podcasts featuring people of color discussing diversity, equity, and inclusion topics in corporate workplaces. This approach enables in‐depth discussions, allowing students to compare and contrast leadership skills and concepts learned from the podcasts. Additionally, students are encouraged to reflect on these skills, fostering a deeper understanding of themselves as diverse and inclusive leaders and the application of leadership concepts to professional workplaces. This method not only enhances student engagement but also promotes critical thinking and the integration of theoretical knowledge with practical insights. It allows students to have a foundational understanding of inclusive leadership practices paired with examples of people in professional environments applying it to the workplace.</p> <p>Value can be found in having students create podcasts in any course or program. The value is derived from students engaging in various skills, including researching content for use in audio broadcasts/files/podcasts and then writing the final script based on the podcast format or type. Students learn to re‐envision the material in a conversational or news format instead of a traditional essay or research paper. The change can help offset some of the challenges instructors have around researching and writing with current college students.</p> <hd id="AN0183689326-11">Advanced Practice/Instructional Strategies</hd> <p>Bullock's advanced instructional strategy for integrating podcasts into leadership education is a comprehensive project where the whole class collaborates in groups to create a podcast series rooted in a research paper and partnered with the leadership office. This endeavor aims to impart a multifaceted skill set, where students deepen their understanding of leadership concepts and enhance their writing, presentation, and communication skills.</p> <p>Students also engage with student affairs professionals to provide a resource to students interested in leadership development and training through the co‐curricular office. As part of this project, students work in groups to write and record podcast scripts, including selecting a team leader, assigning supporting roles, choosing topics, and reframing theoretical content into conversational scripts for a specific audience. Engaging with various communication platforms, students effectively convey ideas and leadership insights, showcasing the practical application of their academic knowledge.</p> <p>Using podcasts as case studies delves into the spectrum of leadership—from exemplary to detrimental. This method encourages students to dissect the reasons behind podcasters' influence, offering a rich, nuanced examination of leadership traits, the impact on followers, and the ethical considerations inherent in leadership and positions. Students can critically evaluate leadership practices through this lens, fostering a deeper understanding of leadership's complexities and its effects on society.</p> <hd id="AN0183689326-12">Recommendations</hd> <p>In this section, we provide practical recommendations for leadership educators and facilitators on effectively integrating podcasts into their curricula and workshops. By considering factors such as podcast selection, student preferences and beliefs, and sound pedagogical practices, educators can enhance the learning experience, foster critical thinking, and promote inclusion. These strategies aim to align podcasts with the desired learning outcomes, support diverse learning styles, and leverage technology to create a more engaging and accessible learning environment.</p> <hd id="AN0183689326-13">Podcast Selection</hd> <p>First, leadership educators and practitioners should consider their audience's learning goals and outcomes. It is essential to ensure that the topic, type, and platform match the desired learning outcomes of the workshop or class. Leadership educators and practitioners can achieve this by clearly defining the outcomes at the start of the training or course development process and using pedagogical and facilitation tools to ensure alignment with the focus of the training or class session. This approach aligns the podcast episodes' content and context to support the program's desired learning outcomes. For example, if you want to introduce the change management principles to students in a leadership course, you can share a podcast from The Leadership Educator podcast that features interviews with leaders discussing their change management strategies.</p> <p>Relatedly, leadership educators can establish clear parameters for assessing the quality, relevance, and appropriateness of podcasts. Quality parameters may include technical aspects such as sound quality and the expertise of hosts and guests, ensuring alignment with programming and course outcomes. For instance, a podcast featuring the original author of a textbook or leadership framework reinforces the credibility and depth of the conversation due to the guest's expertise. Conversely, a podcast hosted by students learning the material might be perceived as less authoritative, given their relative inexperience or limited knowledge of the topic. While such content could offer unique peer‐to‐peer learning perspectives, it poses a challenge for educators, who must carefully assess the knowledge presented and frame the podcast appropriately to students, noting that opinions may reflect varying levels of expertise. Leadership faculty and presenters should consult media literacy research for guidelines on assessing content for inclusion in curricula.</p> <p>Additionally, when adopting podcasts, instructors or facilitators should empower students by involving them in the selection process. This can be done by ensuring the podcasts are easily accessible and align with their learning preferences. First, podcasts should have low or no costs. Instructors who assign podcasts that are not behind paywalls can meet the desire of students who want decreased course costs. If it is necessary to pay, the rationale for the expense should be clearly communicated to the intended participants. For example, <emph>Harvard Business Review</emph> provides podcasts through its online bookstore, which can help replace or supplement case studies.</p> <p>Second, leadership educators should provide transcripts or video caption options in addition to the audio. This ensures that individuals of varying abilities can consume the audio without hindering their learning experience. Assigning podcasts in connection to reading materials and with a transcript demonstrates instructors' commitment to ensuring that all students can understand the material provided. Finally, those using technology to advance learning and skill development should ensure that people can access the technology across various platforms and through existing subscription programs. Traditionally, podcasts are available through Apple, Amazon, Spotify, Google, and other significant audio/video resources. It is easier to share the episodes if students or participants have an existing membership. At Lauren's institution, the Disability Resources and Services department can provide digital tools to translate audio files or outsource the work of converting podcast audio to text.</p> <p>Furthermore, incorporating podcasts allows educators and facilitators to enhance their inclusion efforts. Both students and participants can benefit from listening to various perspectives (e.g., good vs. bad leadership, old vs. new podcasts). Educators and facilitators aim to encourage critical thinking; integrating different leaders' perspectives will prompt students and participants to consider all views. It is crucial to ensure that podcasts are diverse in type, platform, voice, perspective, and release date. For instance, a political leadership class used podcast episodes from both conservative and liberal sources to provide a balanced view of leadership styles. Additionally, educators can provide episodes from different dates to show how perspectives and contexts have evolved. Similarly, a facilitator introducing the DiSC (Geier [<reflink idref="bib15" id="ref40">15</reflink>]) assessment in a workshop can offer various episodes from the sponsoring organization and other executive coaches or trainers to deepen the learning. This diversity of perspectives enriches the learning experience, broadens students' understanding of leadership, and fosters a more inclusive learning environment.</p> <hd id="AN0183689326-14">Student Preferences and Beliefs</hd> <p>In addition to considering how podcast selection is essential, educators must understand student or participant characteristics and preferences. The information must be not only easily accessible and understandable but also match the students' preferred way of learning and belief system. Those leading leadership programs should balance audio and video platforms with other tools such as journal articles and blogs. This allows students or participants to have some modicum of control over their resource selection and ensures there are preferred methods for learning more about leadership.</p> <p>Additionally, instructors and facilitators should be mindful of students' and participants' beliefs about leadership. Building on students' and participants' current beliefs is important and crucial. This approach allows learners to feel connected to and open to the content being shared. Instructors and facilitators should understand their students' and participants' cultural backgrounds, the college or institution's background, and other demographic or psychographic factors. Student surveys at the beginning of the semester or podcast project can reveal some of this information, and assigning a biography project early in the semester can also surface these beliefs.</p> <hd id="AN0183689326-15">Pedagogy</hd> <p>In continuing to be mindful of learners' preferences for resources, students could also benefit from the use of podcasts within scaffolded learning experiences. For example, a workshop participant could read an author's book and listen to an episode where the author discusses the topic before participating in a Q&A session with the author or about the book. Instructors teaching leadership courses could mirror Jenkins's assignment, where students in his graduate leadership education course moderate a discussion board forum on specific <emph>New Directions for Student Leadership</emph> issues. In doing so, students are also provided podcast interviews with the issue editors from the NASPA Leadership Podcast series and The Leadership Educator Podcast archives. This process ensures that students engage with the material in multiple ways, reinforcing their learning and understanding of the leadership concepts.</p> <p>In keeping with strong pedagogical practices, it is important to measure learning or development following the session. When measuring learning, leadership educators and facilitators should evaluate activities or assignments using a rubric or evaluation method that ensures consistency and fairness. Assessment in this specific area is a challenge because of the broad nature of podcasts. However, facilitators and instructors can develop measurements that clearly outline the learning goals or objectives for students or participants and how they will demonstrate mastery of the topic. The TPACK framework can serve as a guide for course instructors through the process of introducing new technology and integrating it seamlessly into the existing curriculum (Dinauer [<reflink idref="bib12" id="ref41">12</reflink>]).</p> <p>While faculty may be familiar with the leadership content, they should understand the leadership and nonleadership skills developed should they opt to create a podcast. This means that instructors may be familiar with leadership concepts and models. However, they should contact communication experts in their professional networks. This helps to ensure a thorough experience that aligns with podcasting best practices. Additionally, faculty and facilitators can read about and watch videos on the technical elements, such as choosing the appropriate equipment and platform to upload podcasts, using editing software to edit the raw audio file, and managing the sound quality. Instructors looking to add new skills to their portfolio could use the creation of podcasts to further their arguments for merit or promotion. Creating podcasts focused on leadership topics would require additional formal and informal training in communication and project management.</p> <hd id="AN0183689326-16">Limitations</hd> <p>While podcasting has been lauded for its accessibility as a medium in both creation and consumption, these same benefits can also serve as drawbacks to employing them. While they may be easy to access, they can be time‐consuming to produce and create steep learning curves in some contexts, for example, for instructors who are unfamiliar with the logistics of creating parameters for produced audio assignments. Using a progressive approach to adding to current courses could ease the stress of implementing a new teaching tool, such as testing it as an extra credit assignment to work through any logistical or outcome‐related challenges. Ethical challenges can also exist when using podcasts. Instructors should ensure they check with institutional review boards and podcast guests, as this could be considered human subjects research.</p> <p>In a similar vein, the strengths of podcasts as conversational artifacts can obfuscate whether they are "science" or "pop culture." They are not peer‐reviewed, do not easily allow for citations (show notes are usual textual accompaniments), and can easily misrepresent facts in the quest for entertainment or "infotainment." For example, what is the "expert" distinction between a podcast interview with someone like Brené Brown versus Taylor Swift? When the podcast The West Wing Weekly brings in a discussion of current politics in its analysis of actor Martin Sheen playing President Josiah Bartlett, is that pop culture or political commentary? These gray areas are both limits and possibilities in exploring podcasting as a conduit and stage for leadership development.</p> <p>While the conversational and informal tone of podcasts enhances their accessibility and engagement, it may inadvertently encourage participants or students to adopt a similar tone in their assignments or assessments. For example, listening to a podcast on situational leadership theory and then being required to write a research paper on the topic could result in students using an informal writing style, which may not align with the expectations of formal academic writing. To address this, educators and facilitators need to provide clear guidance on the structure and format of the output, ensuring that the learning assessment aligns with the assignment requirements.</p> <p>While the newness of podcasting for scholarly research is evident, this novelty features as an opportunity to advance sensorial and discursive methodologies and to explore their meaningfulness to the leadership phenomenon (Cassell et al. [<reflink idref="bib8" id="ref42">8</reflink>]). This process is one that students and new researchers may find invigorating as a creative outlet for the epistemologies of leadership.</p> <hd id="AN0183689326-17">Critique</hd> <p>The COVID‐19 pandemic moved many people from their commute to their couch (Bajaj and Singh [<reflink idref="bib4" id="ref43">4</reflink>]). As such, forms of engagement with podcasts have increasingly moved to visual and video "podcasting," and younger generations may prefer "watching" their podcasts (Tani [<reflink idref="bib40" id="ref44">40</reflink>]). The possible decline of podcasting as it initially emerged could reflect broader changes in cultural norms around entertainment. As a form of pop culture, podcasts can mirror and distort the cultural processes supporting leadership in myriad forms. As such, it is essential to approach their use, creation, and analysis with a critical lens.</p> <p>Primarily, this means that instructors, leadership development programs, and facilitators need to consider reflexive approaches to the medium that surface the tensions inherent in their use. For example, asking who produced the podcast, why, and where it was funded can center development as an emergent process. Like any tool, podcasting can uphold the status quo, perpetuate isolated "hero" and individualistic leadership narratives, and continue institutional injustices. An underlying critical pedagogy, supported by intentions and strategies focused on key student outcomes, could be made visible in implementing podcasting with students.</p> <p>Consider the example of <emph>Raging Moderates</emph>, a political news commentary podcast co‐hosted by author and business owner Scott Galloway and Jessica Tarlov, an American political strategist for the Democratic Party who co‐hosts The Five on Fox News. Galloway is a Professor of Marketing at NYU Stern School of Business, and Galloway's company, Prof G Media, produces the podcast. The podcast dramatically rose in listeners during the 2024 elections in the USA, and Galloway relates that due to modest fixed costs, the podcast might do $2 million in net revenue next year. "Those are not big businesses...but they are ridiculously profitable once you get to a certain point" (Podnews [<reflink idref="bib31" id="ref45">31</reflink>], para. 6). Often, on the podcast, the co‐hosts or guests will comment on the degree to which they relate to the designation of "moderate" in their political beliefs.</p> <p>The political positioning, sometimes campaigning, and tensions mentioned with Tarlov as a Fox News employee are also frequent topics on the podcast. In this sense, it demonstrates the problematization of podcasts to observe, critique, and study leadership. Analyzing this advancement of political discourse as a profitable business under the banner of "Prof G Media" can surface the entanglements of the leadership phenomenon. On view for students is a kind of leadership gray zone that sensorially presents what Grint ([<reflink idref="bib17" id="ref46">17</reflink>]) describes as "a persuasive rendition of the context... reconstructed as a political arena not a scientific laboratory" (1467). It is precisely the ways in which nonfictionalized podcasting can capture the complicated loyalties and motivations of leadership, featured and presented on a public platform, that make it such a tantalizing medium for leadership education, development, and enactment.</p> <hd id="AN0183689326-18">Conclusion</hd> <p>In many ways, using podcasts as a pedagogical tool is an exciting new frontier. Little is known from an empirical perspective about their efficacy, which, in our estimation, is an opportunity for scholars to explore. Until the foundation of empirical data grows, we can only provide first‐person accounts of the benefits and drawbacks of the medium. Based on our experience, we assert that podcasts nicely complement other instructional strategies to provide a well‐rounded and robust learning experience. However, it's unrealistic to think that podcasts alone—specifically pop‐culture podcasts—will be sufficient (Allen et al. [<reflink idref="bib3" id="ref47">3</reflink>]). Like other instructional strategies, there is a time and place depending on learning objectives. Hopefully, there will be no "Bad Blood" among those of you who disagree.</p> <ref id="AN0183689326-19"> <title> References </title> <blist> <bibl id="bib1" idref="ref6" type="bt">1</bibl> <bibtext> Allen, S. J. n.d. 200+ Episodes for Your Leadership Learning. Scott J. Allen. https://<ulink href="http://www.scottjallen.net/podcast">www.scottjallen.net/podcast</ulink>.</bibtext> </blist> <blist> <bibl id="bib2" idref="ref7" type="bt">2</bibl> <bibtext> Allen, S. J. 2023. " Reflections on Starting and Growing a Leadership Podcast." 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  Data: Wiley. Available from: John Wiley & Sons, Inc. 111 River Street, Hoboken, NJ 07030. Tel: 800-835-6770; e-mail: cs-journals@wiley.com; Web site: https://www.wiley.com/en-us
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  Data: This article explores the pedagogical considerations of using pop-culture podcasts as an instructional strategy in leadership development. We clarify key concepts, evaluate podcasts as an instructional tool, and provide recommendations and implications for their integration into leadership learning experiences. While an important consideration for educators, more research is needed about the efficacy of this instructional strategy. Nonetheless, podcasts are an important consideration for program architects seeking contemporary connections to leadership learning.
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            – Type: issue
              Value: 185
          Titles:
            – TitleFull: New Directions for Student Leadership
              Type: main
ResultId 1